wendy shanker

[keryx]

She's way cute, I'll give her that, but...

Is Wendy Shanker a fat positive icon, or an anti-fat apologist?

I never can decide. What do y'all think?

[The icon is off-topic, but I was just thinking yesterday that my younger cat never gets much internets play.]

Comments

[joelandrewtyson.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I don't know, but she's super hot.

Yep, leave it to me to add something important to the debate.

[keryx.livejournal.com]

This is why I like you. Raising the level of the debate. I mean, I was only going to call her "cute".

[rackletang.livejournal.com]

She's very cute.

[fooltheworld.livejournal.com]

Well, based on that interview alone she seems pretty fat-positive to me. Was there anything bothersome for you in it? Or is it other things she's said? I know who she is but I haven't read a lot of her stuff.

[keryx.livejournal.com]

In that interview, her whole thing with "you have to be EXTRA fit to be fat" annoyed me, but otherwise not that much. Her actual book is filled with things that imply a woman's goal should always be prettiness and such.

[peregrin8.livejournal.com]

She seems very pro-capitalist, "let's all go shopping!" but then, it is a Torrid interview...

[chubbycore.livejournal.com]

Is it racist if I say she's a little bit on the pale side?

[originalenid.livejournal.com]

she used to be on that oxygen show, the one about women's point of view on the media... i liked her then.

the interview did seem surprisingly logical, but from what i've heard about fat girls' guide to life, it sounds totally appologist. i'll have to do more reaserch though. like maybe reading part of it. hehe.

[keryx.livejournal.com]

Reading a chapter in the bookstore made me want to kill people. I'll just warn you. Don't read it while armed.

[originalenid.livejournal.com]

uuuh-oh. i'll be sure to try and read it at home... with pillows taped to my hands so i don't break the computer screen.

i know that i told the manager of my torrid that i and all my other torrid shopping friends would rather see them selling Fat!So? than that other thing.

[raanve]

Quote from the linked interview:
They don’t see themselves as skinny chicks...so we must have sympathy for them, too (not a ton, but just a little bit, ladies).

As a self-acknowledge "skinny chick" -- wait, we don't? I think that (and maybe I'm speaking from some kind of "skinny privelege" or something, so feel free to give me the smack-down) body image issues affect just about every woman in this culture, and that no woman ever really escapes the effects of negative body image. Which is why I believe not just in being somehow "fat positive", but in being "body positive" -- being happy in your own skin.

This topic, while I feel pretty strongly about it, often makes me uncomfortable because I sometimes don't feel "entitled" (or whatever) to join in. As someone who's really small, I don't get the negative treatment that larger ladies are often subjected to, but I have caught myself worrying about my size/weight (both "am I too skinny" and the reverse), and I have had people say really rude things to me without even thinking. (I've actually had people ask me, point blank and with a smile, "Are you bulimic?")

I'm rambling... but... is it really about sympathy? Do "skinny chicks" really not see themselves as "skinny chicks"? Shouldn't we all, as women, be supportive of other women and of women of all sizes being able to have a positive body image?

She is cute, though, you got that right.

[raanve]

Oh, and also, she says:
Two things — one is that there is legitimacy to the "fit and fat" concept, and that it’s important to treat your body well at any size. I think if you are considered "overweight," you have an even greater responsibility to eat well, exercise, sleep, etc. Not to prove anything to anyone but yourself...but why not?

These two statments seem contradictory to me -- and the second one seems apologist. "Overweight" by whose and what standard? Why would someone else's perception of one woman as being "overweight" saddle that woman with "an even greater responsibility" to do... anything? And what are you really proving to yourself? Maybe I'm just fundamentally misundertanding her point here.

[keryx.livejournal.com]

I think Not to prove anything to anyone but yourself...but should be finished "the truth is, you really hate yourself, don't you? Well, DON'T YOU?? You must, cause you're a GIRL!"

I don't believe you're misunderstanding that point, or if you are, you're misunderstanding it the way I am. No one should have an obligation to "prove" they're healthy/okay/morally pure/whatever; it's definitely not body-positive to say things like that.

[keryx.livejournal.com]

That's part of my concern with her; I think she reinforces this idea that "we're all just 'big girls' inside", cause all women have such terrible self esteem and terrible self esteem always means thinking being you're fat.

She may in fact be fat positive, but maybe it's just that she doesn't feel all that... woman-positive, maybe? I dunno. She irks me.

[crafting-change.livejournal.com]

The article seemed pretty light, but as you've said elsewhere the 'we have to be extra fit' comment totally seemed like a 'don't rock the boat'..I hear a lot of 'we have to look normal/have normal jobs' from the pagan community..that sort of 'mainstreaming' plea makes my blood boil.

[keryx.livejournal.com]

Yes, that's it - it's the whole "we have to prove to others that we're normal enough" thing. It doesn't make any sense in any context to me.

[snidegrrl.livejournal.com]

seemed innocuous, except this:

I think if you are considered "overweight," you have an even greater responsibility to eat well, exercise, sleep, etc. Not to prove anything to anyone but yourself…but why not?

uh, sorry. everyone has the same respobsibility which is arguably small. why not? i enjoy eating whatever the hell i want, thanks.

[keryx.livejournal.com]

OMFG. that whole "responsibility" thing - to whom? does that line actually work on anyone?

[rackletang.livejournal.com]

I have no idea. The whole thing barely skimmed the surface of... well, anything. *shrug* Seems shallow to me, but maybe that's because it's on Torrid's site. I don't know...

[peregrin8.livejournal.com]

And while you're at it, be sure to skim the surface of these great new spring fashions at Torrid!

[keryx.livejournal.com]

The surface skimming? Pretty much the tone of her book, too. Although... you could skim the surface and still scratch it a little, if you're using the right tool.

[fierceawakening.livejournal.com]

Ack.

"I want to take away the emotional associations of the word 'fat,'" she told me in an interview. "It doesn't mean lazy or depressed or unambitious. To me, it just means 'not thin.'" http://www.forward.com/main/article.php?ref=200404291028%20%20%20%20%20

Because it's perfectly a-ok to define people by what they're not...

[keryx.livejournal.com]

Ooh, I wouldn't have thought of that. But YES. Why can't it just mean "fat"?

[firecat]

I think she is a fat positive icon, but she sure isn't my fat positive icon. Too perky. And I do get that for a lot of women fat acceptance is all about the clothes at first, but...

As for I think if you are considered "overweight," you have an even greater responsibility to eat well, exercise, sleep, etc. Not to prove anything to anyone but yourself...but why not? -- that makes NO fucking sense. Either I'm doing what you tell me to (which is what "you have a responsibility" means) or I'm doing something for myself. I can't do it for myself for you. I know that bazillions of women think exactly that way, but I don't and it drives me batshit.

[keryx.livejournal.com]

I think people may simply no longer know what it means to do something for yourself, after years and years of being told to do things like "lose weight for yourself", "get new breasts for yourself", etc. It's a phrase that's lost most of its meaning and come to stand in for just anything that is self-absorbed, or body-focused.