the anti-us side. sigh.
Apr. 27th, 2004 03:20 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
keryxSomething I cross-posted to my blog about the people shouting at us from the sidelines on Sunday.
Puzzled by the mix of attack-dog tactics (people with - I hope - fake fetuses in jars shoving them towards us, people calling us "wicked" and congratulating murderers of abortion doctors) and stoic silence (the "I'm sorry" crew, the "women deserve better" crew), I tried reading some of the accounts from pro-lifers who were at the March.
I can't.
I occasionally read the posts on After Abortion. I think we, as the pro-choice majority, need to recognize that individual women's stories aren't all about not being sorry. Some women are sorry, either when they do it or after. We alienate them when we act as if abortion is a simple issue for everyone. Most of those women don't, typically, argue that abortion and other reproductive choice resources shouldn't be legal, safe and available on demand. They just want to have their pain recognized. When we don't do that, they just feel anti-us. That makes them anti-choice, polarizes them when they didn't need to be polarized.
Is a man made to feel guilty for his vasectomy? Is he pushed to celebrate it? If he feels sad, is the only place he can turn to a pro-life community that calls him a reformed baby-killer? FUCK FUCKING NO. And yet hasn't he removed potential children from the world? This is an issue for all women, that we need to be able to recognize abortion as both a safe, legal outpatient surgery and a complex issue.
As supporters of choice, supporters of the rights of all women, I feel we need to stand by these women who regret abortions, need to respect that this is their feeling. Not because abortions are bad or wrong or need to be outlawed, but because their individual experience was bad. And if the pro-choice community can't see that, we drive more people to the pro-life camp. A camp whose followers bullhorned at me, called me names, called me a whore and shouted biblical verses at me (I guess they thought I was also a subscriber to their bible, which was perhaps a mistake). That camp shouldn't be the only welcoming audience for a woman who regrets or hesitates choosing to abort.
I personally don't give a rat's ass what choice any individual woman may make where abortion and birth control are concerned. I just want all these choices to be available. And I don't understand how someone, particularly a woman, could see otherwise (for instance, believing both sex education and abortion are wrong - how the heck does that work?).
So I read the March-related posts on After Abortion and on Diotima and the LJ abortion debate community.
Or, I started to read them.
And then I saw this pattern of generally moderate pro-life folk making comments about how we aren't really feminists, how all pro-choice folk at the March were mean (dude, did they actually encounter all of the million of us? I'm imfuckingpressed). It left me shaking with rage.
And I wonder if we can really have a civilized debate about this.
For now, I think, I'm just not reading any more of the pro-life side of the March coverage. I'll wait until they've cooled down a bit. I'll wait until the memories of some of the things that came out of those anti-us bullhorns are a bit softer.
But, like the women who regret their abortions, I feel polarized by this debate. I feel like I can't even speak or listen to someone who is strongly pro-life (or, as I come to think more and more, anti-choice) anymore.
And I'm thankful that we're the majority. Because if it has to be a contest instead of a compromise, I'd like to win.
Puzzled by the mix of attack-dog tactics (people with - I hope - fake fetuses in jars shoving them towards us, people calling us "wicked" and congratulating murderers of abortion doctors) and stoic silence (the "I'm sorry" crew, the "women deserve better" crew), I tried reading some of the accounts from pro-lifers who were at the March.
I can't.
I occasionally read the posts on After Abortion. I think we, as the pro-choice majority, need to recognize that individual women's stories aren't all about not being sorry. Some women are sorry, either when they do it or after. We alienate them when we act as if abortion is a simple issue for everyone. Most of those women don't, typically, argue that abortion and other reproductive choice resources shouldn't be legal, safe and available on demand. They just want to have their pain recognized. When we don't do that, they just feel anti-us. That makes them anti-choice, polarizes them when they didn't need to be polarized.
Is a man made to feel guilty for his vasectomy? Is he pushed to celebrate it? If he feels sad, is the only place he can turn to a pro-life community that calls him a reformed baby-killer? FUCK FUCKING NO. And yet hasn't he removed potential children from the world? This is an issue for all women, that we need to be able to recognize abortion as both a safe, legal outpatient surgery and a complex issue.
As supporters of choice, supporters of the rights of all women, I feel we need to stand by these women who regret abortions, need to respect that this is their feeling. Not because abortions are bad or wrong or need to be outlawed, but because their individual experience was bad. And if the pro-choice community can't see that, we drive more people to the pro-life camp. A camp whose followers bullhorned at me, called me names, called me a whore and shouted biblical verses at me (I guess they thought I was also a subscriber to their bible, which was perhaps a mistake). That camp shouldn't be the only welcoming audience for a woman who regrets or hesitates choosing to abort.
I personally don't give a rat's ass what choice any individual woman may make where abortion and birth control are concerned. I just want all these choices to be available. And I don't understand how someone, particularly a woman, could see otherwise (for instance, believing both sex education and abortion are wrong - how the heck does that work?).
So I read the March-related posts on After Abortion and on Diotima and the LJ abortion debate community.
Or, I started to read them.
And then I saw this pattern of generally moderate pro-life folk making comments about how we aren't really feminists, how all pro-choice folk at the March were mean (dude, did they actually encounter all of the million of us? I'm imfuckingpressed). It left me shaking with rage.
And I wonder if we can really have a civilized debate about this.
For now, I think, I'm just not reading any more of the pro-life side of the March coverage. I'll wait until they've cooled down a bit. I'll wait until the memories of some of the things that came out of those anti-us bullhorns are a bit softer.
But, like the women who regret their abortions, I feel polarized by this debate. I feel like I can't even speak or listen to someone who is strongly pro-life (or, as I come to think more and more, anti-choice) anymore.
And I'm thankful that we're the majority. Because if it has to be a contest instead of a compromise, I'd like to win.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
(no subject)
Date: 2004-04-27 12:32 pm (UTC)I think that it might be misleading to compare abortion and vasectomy. The more logical comparison there is vasectomy and tubal ligation. I can see how abortion is (possibly) about ending a life, whereas vasectomy/tubal ligation is about preventing pregnancy.
However, that said, I agree with you. I personally don't believe that I could ever go through with having an abortion. That is not a choice that I could make. What is important to me is that I (and all other women in this country) HAVE that choice, and that it is a safe, healthy choice.
I'm pro-choice, without question. I'm also pro-life, in that I respect the lives and choices of women, respect life enough to be against the death penalty (how can you call yourself pro-life and at the same time advocate state-sponsored killing??), and feel that I would rather see ALL children have happy, healthy, supportive homes. I'm also a realist, and I know that there are thousands of mitigating circumstances that make that last point difficult, at best, to acheive , for millions of children & mothers & parents.
I don't think I can read the anti-choice accounts of the March, either. I don't understand how women can be against the goals that the March was all about. It was more than an abortion rights gesture. It's about choices, about supporting women, about valuing life of all kinds and stages, about making sure that our young people are educated properly in order to keep them safe, to let them know that they have power -- the power to choose what's right for them, and to be informed about their choices.
Ach. I'm rambling. Forgive me. -_^
(no subject)
Date: 2004-04-27 01:12 pm (UTC)In my book, tubal ligation isn't substantially further from murder than abortion. But fine, point taken. ;)
The thing that I really don't get is that it seems like (from reading their posts & books) a lot of pro-life folk reject comprehensive sex ed, condom distribution, better Medicaid and WIC provisions, expanding welfare provisions, universal healthcare and all the other things that could prevent abortions or make an unwanted kid less of a burden (all the other things we marched for). So... um, what's the alternative in that case? I guess, either adoption or begetting more poor people and future criminals.
Now I'm rambling, though, and feeling pretty testy.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-04-27 02:27 pm (UTC)Basically, there's a whole vast swathe of people out there, maybe larger than both of the more vocal camps, who are not comfortable with abortion, but are unwilling to tell anyone else not to do it. Their complacency is what's going to get things turned backwards, that combined with the fundies with power. It's not for us to convince the fundies and radicals on the other side, the task is to get the fence sitters to understand what happens when they let the fundies limit the options.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-04-27 04:24 pm (UTC)I've been meaning to say this since you posted...
Date: 2004-04-28 10:44 pm (UTC)Excellent post. I especially like that last bit. Because dammit, we are going to win this thing. Out of touch and irrelevant my ass. Also, I like what Kim said about discussing this issue with the fencesitters, because she's right--they hold a lot of power and could very well be key in this battle. They need as much information as we can provide (and that they are willing to take).
Just one thing, however: what about the anti-borschtists? What is their role in all of this?
Re: I've been meaning to say this since you posted...
Date: 2004-04-29 05:20 am (UTC)Up with borscht, I say!
And thanks. I know a march isn't the place to talk to/about the fence folk, but we haveta keep them in mind the other 364 days this year. What I'd like is some advice from fencesitters on what information they need to be converted off the fence. I just don't know very many fencesitters to ask that question of.